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Obscurus Crusade  |  Costuming  |  The Inquisition  |  Adepta Sororitas Power Armour [Helmet Sculpting!]
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Author Topic: Adepta Sororitas Power Armour [Helmet Sculpting!]  (Read 12359 times)

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Offline Vickibrownies

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Adepta Sororitas Power Armour [Helmet Sculpting!]
« Reply #15 on: February 05, 2012, 06:33:00 PM »
Quote from: Finnlock date=1328420880
Are you planing on making backpacks as well?
Yeah, I plan on doing it all.  Much like my original set, in fact, if we didn't have the back pack where would the Radios, Battery Pack for the electronics and the Camel-bak water pouch go?


I'm not confident about how my mould will come out, but I guess we'll find out over the next few days.
Thanks for all the advise!

-Vicki

Offline Finnlock

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Adepta Sororitas Power Armour [Helmet Sculpting!]
« Reply #16 on: February 05, 2012, 06:38:00 PM »
I like the improvments you have made to the master!

I hope the mold turns out masterfully!

Offline Vickibrownies

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Adepta Sororitas Power Armour [Helmet Sculpting!]
« Reply #17 on: February 05, 2012, 08:22:00 PM »
Quote from: Finnlock date=1328485080
I like the improvments you have made to the master!

I hope the mold turns out masterfully!
Haha, it won't do, as I say, I've never done this before.

Also, to make the mother mould I'm using Jesmonite because, well, I hate Polyester resin and since it snowed overnight using it would take forever since it's too cold in the garage for it to cure.
So, water based resin it is ... however, I forgot how much this stuff sucks itself.

I'm just going to carry on and see what comes out, it's not like it's beyond my wits to completely remake the master if I have to.

*Update*

I screwed up the mother mould, both halves are fixed together.
So, I've gotta figure a way to cut it open without damaging it, fml.

Offline Vickibrownies

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Adepta Sororitas Power Armour [Helmet Sculpting!]
« Reply #18 on: February 07, 2012, 09:35:00 AM »
So, update time!

I failed badly, well, not as badly as I could have but fairly badly.

What happened you ask?
Because I'm either lazy, impatient or afraid of Polyester Resin, I decided to use some Jesmonite Water based resin that I had around instead of Fiberglass Polyester resin because, well, it was -4 outside and I didn't think the Polyester Resin would set very fast and I wanted to get on as fast as I could.
So, I made the first half mother mould for my helmet, then put some pretty poor release agent over the gap and did the other half.  Needless to day I all sealed shut.

So I have just had to cut it all open, damaging the Master Sculpt.
However, it also showed me that I had made silicone layer much to thin so I have ordered some Thixo for it to do a second proper layer.

Live a Learn.

I have about two days of work to recover the Master Sculpt, so, new attempt at silicone casting on Friday and mother mould on Saturday.  Will be doing the damn properly, using tin foil and whatnot, and also using Polyester Resin this time around.


As you can see, luckily, it is much more heavily damaged on one side than the other.

Thanks for keeping up. [img]http://i6.ifrm.com/html/emoticons/happy.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='happy.gif' />
I kinda suck at this xD

Offline Capt.

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Adepta Sororitas Power Armour [Helmet Sculpting!]
« Reply #19 on: February 07, 2012, 11:57:00 AM »
I know it's a little damaged- but instead of repairing the helmet, make it a feature... Battle scars so to speak. I don't think it looks that bad, to be honest.
Best of luck on round 2. [img]http://i6.ifrm.com/html/emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif' />

Offline Vickibrownies

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Adepta Sororitas Power Armour [Helmet Sculpting!]
« Reply #20 on: February 07, 2012, 12:09:00 PM »
Quote from: Capt. date=1328633820
I know it's a little damaged- but instead of repairing the helmet, make it a feature... Battle scars so to speak. I don't think it looks that bad, to be honest.
Best of luck on round 2. [img]http://i6.ifrm.com/html/emoticons/smile.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='smile.gif' />
Nah, the characters the armour is for it would be new armour.

Bedsides, I much much MUCH prefer to have a clean mould to work from and then batter up the stuff that comes out of it afterwards.
Because I'm going to be using these castings are a base for other moulded work in the furture, like using this helm as a base for doing a Celestian Helm, with the Fleur do Lys over the eys and whatnot.

And thanks for the luck, I shall hog it all as I need it!!

Offline SINISTER

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Adepta Sororitas Power Armour [Helmet Sculpting!]
« Reply #21 on: February 07, 2012, 01:32:00 PM »
Being an old hand at this casting lark, I feel your pain.  [img]http://i6.ifrm.com/html/emoticons/sad.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='sad.gif' />  I've also had problems like this in the past. For the silicone mold you need at least a 1cm thick covering and more if you're dealing with undercuts to prevent sagging when the mold is cleaned out and sitting in its jacket. You're right in that temperature is an issue. It will take longer to cure but cutting corners as you have seen is not the answer.
Your sculpt, as Capt has said is not that badly damaged and I agree it shouldn't take much work to get it back to looking pristine again. Do make sure you blather that silicone on good and thick. And if you're slush casting do try and have a fiberglass jacket rather than a plaster one, as it really does make a difference to the weight . If not, then make sure you use "Ultracal" as it's a plaster that's designed to be used as a casting jacket and stands up to a greater deal of abuse, a bonus if multiple copies are needed. Again if this is not possible then dental plaster with layers of hemp matting or sack cloth to provide strength, but be prepared to handle something that weighs an absolute ton. I speak from experience. Your arms are going to feel like lead and your shoulders will ache, slush or roto-casting something like this.
Anyway. Good luck.  [img]http://i6.ifrm.com/html/emoticons/wink.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='wink.gif' />   [img]http://i6.ifrm.com/14623/129/emo/0f352eae45b08d26760469319a4704f6.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='0f352eae45b08d26760469319a4704f6.gif' />   [img]http://i6.ifrm.com/14623/129/emo/9cf395a8c958ff16084fd1f2a0ca1cee.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='9cf395a8c958ff16084fd1f2a0ca1cee.gif' />

Offline Hellwolve

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Adepta Sororitas Power Armour [Helmet Sculpting!]
« Reply #22 on: February 07, 2012, 01:39:00 PM »
I hope no-one minds me interrerupting, but I've heard the term "slush casting" many times before. Though I think I know what it is, I'd love to hear some more [img]http://i6.ifrm.com/html/emoticons/wink.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='wink.gif' />
"...and the earth becomes my throne
I adapt to the unknown
Under wandering stars I've grown
By myself but not alone"

Offline Vickibrownies

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Adepta Sororitas Power Armour [Helmet Sculpting!]
« Reply #23 on: February 07, 2012, 02:58:00 PM »
Quote from: SINISTER date=1328639520
Being an old hand at this casting lark, I feel your pain.  [img]http://i6.ifrm.com/html/emoticons/sad.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='sad.gif' />  I've also had problems like this in the past. For the silicone mold you need at least a 1cm thick covering and more if you're dealing with undercuts to prevent sagging when the mold is cleaned out and sitting in its jacket. You're right in that temperature is an issue. It will take longer to cure but cutting corners as you have seen is not the answer.
Your sculpt, as Capt has said is not that badly damaged and I agree it shouldn't take much work to get it back to looking pristine again. Do make sure you blather that silicone on good and thick. And if you're slush casting do try and have a fiberglass jacket rather than a plaster one, as it really does make a difference to the weight . If not, then make sure you use "Ultracal" as it's a plaster that's designed to be used as a casting jacket and stands up to a greater deal of abuse, a bonus if multiple copies are needed. Again if this is not possible then dental plaster with layers of hemp matting or sack cloth to provide strength, but be prepared to handle something that weighs an absolute ton. I speak from experience. Your arms are going to feel like lead and your shoulders will ache, slush or roto-casting something like this.
Anyway. Good luck.  [img]http://i6.ifrm.com/html/emoticons/wink.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='wink.gif' />   [img]http://i6.ifrm.com/14623/129/emo/0f352eae45b08d26760469319a4704f6.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='0f352eae45b08d26760469319a4704f6.gif' />   [img]http://i6.ifrm.com/14623/129/emo/9cf395a8c958ff16084fd1f2a0ca1cee.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='9cf395a8c958ff16084fd1f2a0ca1cee.gif' />
Yeah, thanks for the advise.

I have ordered some Thixo for my silicone, so when that arrives I shall do a liquid layer first and then a second thickened layer over that.

As for the Mother mold, I'm defiantly not succumbing to my impatience again and going to straight up use Polyester Fibreglass resin and not wimp out.
Will also give me an excuse to spend an hour sorting out some workspace in our Garage.

Will also try and be nice and fancy and try and put a lip at the side of it for bolts to go through to hold the two sides together. [img]http://i6.ifrm.com/html/emoticons/happy.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='happy.gif' />

Offline SINISTER

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Adepta Sororitas Power Armour [Helmet Sculpting!]
« Reply #24 on: February 08, 2012, 02:28:00 PM »
Sounds like you'll be onto a winner this time Vicki. If you don't fancy doing a lip to bolt through you can make tabs to bolt through. One at the front, one on top and one at the back. This will do the same job and is a hell of a lot easier to do. If you don't fancy that and you're just going to have the 2 halves butt up against each other then you can wrap a bungee strap around it to hold them in place, it's cruder but it does work!!  [img]http://i6.ifrm.com/html/emoticons/biggrin.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='biggrin.gif' />

Hellwolve. The name says it all. Add casting resin to your mold and slush it all around until the resin sets. Add and repeat. Simple!  [img]http://i6.ifrm.com/html/emoticons/laugh.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='laugh.gif' />

 [img]http://i6.ifrm.com/14623/129/emo/0f352eae45b08d26760469319a4704f6.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='0f352eae45b08d26760469319a4704f6.gif' />   [img]http://i6.ifrm.com/14623/129/emo/9cf395a8c958ff16084fd1f2a0ca1cee.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='9cf395a8c958ff16084fd1f2a0ca1cee.gif' />

Offline Hellwolve

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Adepta Sororitas Power Armour [Helmet Sculpting!]
« Reply #25 on: February 08, 2012, 02:30:00 PM »
I didn't know resin could set that fast [img]http://i6.ifrm.com/html/emoticons/blink.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='blink.gif' /> And doesn't that make for very uneven casts?
"...and the earth becomes my throne
I adapt to the unknown
Under wandering stars I've grown
By myself but not alone"

Offline Vickibrownies

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Adepta Sororitas Power Armour [Helmet Sculpting!]
« Reply #26 on: February 08, 2012, 02:39:00 PM »
Quote from: Hellwolve date=1328729400
I didn't know resin could set that fast [img]http://i6.ifrm.com/html/emoticons/blink.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='blink.gif' /> And doesn't that make for very uneven casts?
The plastic Resins that are used for this sort of thing usually set too FAST to do Roto-casting!
You have to get a special type that takes 10-15 minutes to set rather than 2-3minutes as the normal pouring ones (and to a lesser extent pourable)

And yes, as I understand, they can come out very uneven, so you need to slosh it about a lot, nice a quick, and do a number of layers in succession, you're talking about 40minutes of just rolling a mould around in your arms.

They then take around 24-36hours to reach 'fully cured' where they get to full strength, but yes, they are quick.

@SINISTER
Yeah, the Tabs sounds easier, I think I'll likely end up having a little bit of mat looped deliberately up against the damn in a number of places rather than going straight for a full lip.  
Thanks for the hint.

I want to go for properly bolting it together because I want this to last a decent enough time, for my personal plans I want at least 5 casts out of this mould.

Offline SINISTER

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Adepta Sororitas Power Armour [Helmet Sculpting!]
« Reply #27 on: February 08, 2012, 02:54:00 PM »
Not wanting to hijack this thread, so I'll give the short and succinct answer.

It depends on the type of resin you're using. For example. I use Biresin G26, it's a 1:1 two part polyester resin this has a working life of 10-12 mins once mixed. This is fine for slush casting as you're adding no more than 100ml of resin to the mold at any one time so the layers build up gradually. This also prevents "runs" within the mold. This can happen if too much resin is added at any one time due to when it starts to cure it starts to resemble treacle and moves slower. In addition, this can also cause the resin that's already coated the mold to "bunch up" which also causes unevenness inside the helmet. You never get it totally smooth unless you're using a roto casting rig, but then it doesn't need to be as you'll no doubt be padding it out with foam.
I hope this answers your questions.  [img]http://i6.ifrm.com/html/emoticons/wink.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='wink.gif' />  Now back to the thread.  [img]http://i6.ifrm.com/html/emoticons/biggrin.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='biggrin.gif' />   [img]http://i6.ifrm.com/14623/129/emo/0f352eae45b08d26760469319a4704f6.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='0f352eae45b08d26760469319a4704f6.gif' />

Offline Vickibrownies

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Adepta Sororitas Power Armour [Helmet Sculpting!]
« Reply #28 on: February 08, 2012, 02:58:00 PM »
Quote from: SINISTER date=1328730840
Not wanting to hijack this thread, so I'll give the short and succinct answer.

It depends on the type of resin you're using. For example. I use Biresin G26, it's a 1:1 two part polyester resin this has a working life of 10-12 mins once mixed. This is fine for slush casting as you're adding no more than 100ml of resin to the mold at any one time so the layers build up gradually. This also prevents "runs" within the mold. This can happen if too much resin is added at any one time due to when it starts to cure it starts to resemble treacle and moves slower. In addition, this can also cause the resin that's already coated the mold to "bunch up" which also causes unevenness inside the helmet. You never get it totally smooth unless you're using a roto casting rig, but then it doesn't need to be as you'll no doubt be padding it out with foam.
I hope this answers your questions.  [img]http://i6.ifrm.com/html/emoticons/wink.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='wink.gif' />  Now back to the thread.  [img]http://i6.ifrm.com/html/emoticons/biggrin.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='biggrin.gif' />   [img]http://i6.ifrm.com/14623/129/emo/0f352eae45b08d26760469319a4704f6.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='0f352eae45b08d26760469319a4704f6.gif' />
You're not technically hijacking the thread because this is all useful information for me as well!
I've not actually done any casting quite like this before, let alone Roto-casting plastic, so it's all useful.

And yes, it may come out uneven, but in theory that doesn't matter too much since it'll only be the inside that's uneven.  And you can go over it (correct me if I'm wrong) with some brush on stuff for extra strength.
Since my costume is going to be used for LARP most of mind is going to be reinforced with a brush on Resin with glass fibre mat.

Offline SINISTER

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Adepta Sororitas Power Armour [Helmet Sculpting!]
« Reply #29 on: February 08, 2012, 03:03:00 PM »
You should be fine with 5 pulls from this mold Vicki. The bolting method just holds everything solid. It's the silicone mold that you have to worry about holding up to being pulled off repeated casts. The mold I mentioned with the fibreglass jacket halves that were held together with a bungee strap managed to give me 6 good pulls and one ropey one (which got fixed up with some filler), before the mold went to the bin.
So long as the silicone is on good and thick you'll have no trouble. Honest!  [img]http://i6.ifrm.com/14623/129/emo/0f352eae45b08d26760469319a4704f6.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='0f352eae45b08d26760469319a4704f6.gif' />   [img]http://i6.ifrm.com/14623/129/emo/9cf395a8c958ff16084fd1f2a0ca1cee.gif' border='0' style='vertical-align:middle' alt='9cf395a8c958ff16084fd1f2a0ca1cee.gif' />

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